Survey Information

Survey Information

Posted by Kirk Baldwin on Jan 22, 2011 1:09 pm

I just don't get it.  I do a survey, locate a coule of pins with caps near my property, call the surveyor whos pins I found only to hear the words out of his mouth as, " I dont' give out my information" W.T.F.....Are you Fricking kidding me. Of course, this is not a recorded survey or anything, but an ALTA survey that this moron did a few years back, thus re-establishing a couple of Block corners.  I wasn't asking for his stupid CADD file, his crappy aarsed notes, just a fricking copy of his survey in pdf form or scribbled on a napkin for all I care, so that I could possibly use the same evidence or part of it thereof to do my survey. Sometimes surveyors need to put their stupid pride straight up their South end of their North bound donkey. To top it all off this big pile of monkey spue surveyor is a board member as well. What part of all this "If we surveyors all used the same evidence" their would be no boundary conflicts.  I mean they preach and preach this stuff and yet their are some dikk heads that just don't get it.  Here are some words of advice to those individuals. "GET OVER YOURSELF, YOUR SURVEY WAS NOT THAT GOOD ANYWAY". 

Re: Survey Information

Posted by Mark on Jan 23, 2011 8:34 am

Maybe your last sentence hit the nail on the head. The survey turned out to not be all that good. Maybe the party chief turned out to be unreliable. Maybe his information turned out to be unreliable. who knows. When a surveyor I question disavows his survey (and that's what your's did), I label his points as found, and as 'apparent traverse points'. Not even offset points, unless I choose to accept them from some othe information. Just be glad he's not asking you to perpetuate his old mistakes. Not asking you to take liabilty for his old mistakes. Remember that he's not rigid about being known as any good, and move on.

Re: Survey Information

Posted by Tommy Young on Jan 25, 2011 5:36 pm

I've never had a problem giving another surveyor a copy of my old drawings.  Now, depending on the situation, I might not give them a CAD file.  Don't beat me out of a project and then expect all my electronic drawings.

Re: Survey Information

Posted by A Harris on Jan 25, 2011 7:38 pm

I get the same response from some surveyors. They are also among those surveyors that do not find monuments of record found or set by other surveyors.

It seems that as a part of their plan to not share information, they also do not recognize the information that others use or have set.

I am in the process of trying to obtain a copy of a survey made on the same boundaries that I have set monuments recently. Upon our return to survey an adjacent proeprty, we found their monuments several feet from ours and not in line between R/W monuments of record and not matching any record information I have found. The caps on the monuments provide no informtion to link with any surveyor I know.

Everything that I have heard on this subject amazes me to no end and I will never understand any surveyor placing them on such an island by themselves. In my beginning years, it was a long standing tradition that surveyors opened their information to share with other surveyors and would have a welcome debate if necessary to explain their point of view.

I can only come to the conclusion that the reason that some do not want anyone to be able to view their work is that they must not be proud of what they do.

I have always welcomed to provide my information to others to avoid any possibility of a conflict to happen because a monument was missing or in an area that it could not be located because it was among a clutter of other objects.

Paper copies are fine, I do not give CAD files away.

Re: Survey Information

Posted by HOLE DIGGER on Jan 25, 2011 7:55 pm

I have been very fortunate to have always been able to work with other surveyors whose prior work is important to my project or for whom my prior work is important tot heir project.  This is how it really needs to be.  So what if somewhere along the line I come to disagree with some part of their survey.  We're big boys.  We can work it out.  It is probably something that one of us has misunderstood that can be simply explained by the other.

Re: Survey Information

Posted by stephen sheffield on Jan 26, 2011 9:08 am

Everyone has their own policy about sharing information.  As a general rule I always provide a copy of a map if asked, PROVIDED, that it is ok with the person who paid for the survey (when possible) even CAD.  BUT I still consider it my right NOT to provide a copy if I choose not to.  I'm lucky, like Hole Digger, in that I've been very fortunate to be in an area where the local surveyors work together very well in sharing information and insight.

Re: Survey Information

Posted by CChaney on Jan 26, 2011 11:20 am

Having all of the relevant drawings, documents, etc. is always invaluable when you are conducting your survey and deciding on which monuments to hang your hat on. This has always been an issue in the surveying industy and will probably not get any better. However, remember that the field data and the product that derived from it is the property of the client. And without his/her permission, you cannot simply hand that information over to any other party.

Consider this...Neighbor A is suing Neighbor B for whatever reason. You are Neighbor C. Before the case makes it to court, they settle. You see an opportunity to cash in as well. You know the attorney for Neighbor B personally. You call the attorney for Neighbor B and request a copy of what the issue was about and what the settlement was.

Do you think the attorney simply gave the information up without obtaining permission from his client. If he did, surely he would be brought in front of the bar. As professionals, I believe it our responsibility to treat that type of information as an attorney or doctor would his client or patient's information.

Of course, if the map is of public record, then all bets are off.

Re: Survey Information

Posted by msibole on Jan 26, 2011 3:10 pm

Surveyors should always cooperate with other surveyors.  I think there should be full disclosure of the survey plat.  If there is information you don't want other surveyors to have then don't put it on the drawing.  I have more often than not located many more property corners than I needed for a boundary, but not all of the monuments end up on my plat. 

Just my 2 cents


Re: Survey Information... Proffesional cooperation is the way....

Posted by RADU on Jan 27, 2011 2:29 am

A no share attitude reeks of incompetence or misguided arrogance.

Here in SOZ we have the benifit of  common starting points as all plans lodged for boundary division or change to boundary title dimensions  are stored in a central plan register.  Even so we can notice a surveyor has worked near by and we all cooperate. You never know you just may have made an error and the other set of eyes may catch it in time .

I was out in the field with a Texan surveyor who had a great professional relationship with his piers,\. Where the understanding was for searching and copying any of their records "the cost" was a copy of the survey made as it effectively updated current plan  marks to found or missing and provided the new stepping stones if they in the future ever had a survey.

What  I call proffesional surveyors


Re: Survey Information

Posted by MLB on Jan 27, 2011 12:12 pm

We should clear up a possible misconception. Even in a "Recordation State" there are still surveys that don't get recorded. If you do not create a new lot, set a corner, or replace a corner filing is not required. It is still optional in some cases. If you recover every corner of a property in good condition and position, you don't have to file anything. But you can create a plat just for your client showing that. This is one type of "Confidential Survey". The disposition of a Confidential Survey is at the discretion of the Survey and/or the client.

But if you mark a boundary i.e., set a new cap, you must record your work. And that is a good thing.

Re: Survey Information

Posted by ron berry on Jan 27, 2011 2:27 pm

I have always shared my files with fellow surveyors and have a lot of success having other surveyors share files with me. Working in several counties I tend to get a lot of info from local surveyors which helps out in the rugged mountainous terrain, most of these survey plats don't get recorded, that is why I will alway take my plat and have the owners sign it and get it recorded for them, instead of the plat laying in a barn or the back of a pick up truck. Just my 0.02 cents worth..."Help your fellow Surveyor" makes for a better world....

Re: Survey Information

Posted by Andrew Camp on Jan 30, 2011 11:01 am

I've always been happy to share our records with other surveyors (we have about 60-70 years worth in our office) as long as they:
  • Are polite - please don't act like you are entitled to the information and remember that we are helping you.
  • Are not pushing their research efforts off on us - this one happens OFTEN!  It really make me mad to hear the person on the other end of the telephone asking for our information while confessing they have not researched the records at the clerk's office or couldn't get the copy online.  If your client hired you to prepare the survey, then be prepared to find the record document(s).  That is your responsibility, not mine.
  • Offer to pay for our time and the copy - I do not charge for an emailed copy as long as the surveyor offers to compensate me for the time.  Time is money, which is why you called requesting the copy, so reciprocate.  If the requesting caller doesn't offer to pay, I send them an invoice with the copy.
  • Don't make it hard on us to send you the information - Don't ask me to fax you a 24"x36" plat.  Seriously?  That is a waste of all our time (time=money).
  • Call me and ask me (surveyor to surveyor) - If office admin calls requesting a copy, then I let them talk to my office admin - clearly you were not overly concerned with anything other than the copy so that is all you get.  I cannot recall how many times a polite phone call (which most surveyor are) from the licensed surveyor preparing the survey requesting the information results in a 10-15 minute exchange of information about the property and surrounding properties we may have surveyed, too, followed by another 5-10 minutes of exchanging stories and pleasantries. 
  • The golden rule goes along way with us surveyors.

    Re: Survey Information

    Posted by MLB on Jan 30, 2011 11:18 am

    Bravo Mr. Camp! Thanks for pointing out that providing information  is one thing, doing someone else's work is quite another. Getting "conned" into doing someone else's research is annoying. When someone "outsources" his research to you, then you should be getting paid the hourly "Consultant Rate". Because , in truth , that is what you have become. 

    Re: Survey Information

    Posted by Mark on Jan 30, 2011 11:28 am

    I like that idea of getting paid for what you do and what you provide too. Along those lines, has anyone ever thought of an online store for prior surveys? Put  PDF's and DWG's in an online database and charge a fee, paid by paypal or whatever, to download them over the internet?